History
I tried to think of something both edifying and spiritual to write about, but it's hot here, and I'm tired, so instead I'm just going to do what's fun (for me, anyway) and chat about history :-)
* Who is your favorite Roman Emperor?
I'd have to pick Marcus Aurelius. Nope, not because he was in Gladiator :-) but because of his Meditations. I first read the book in college, when I was trying very hard not to feel anything, and Stoicism really hit the mark. Here's an example ...
If thou art pained by any external thing, it is not this that disturbs thee, but thy own judgment about it. And it is in thy power to wipe out this judgment now.
I loved this idea that we can control our feelings. Not surprising that Aurelius would like it too ... by all accounts, he had a bad marraige, and his son ... !
- Richard Harris, from Gladiator, as Marcus Aurelius
* What's your favorite historical battle?
Another one of thos burning questions that keep us up at night! My choice would be the battle of Stamford Bridge and the battle of Hastings, together. They took place in England in 1066, and things went like this ...
The king of England, Harold Godwinson, did not have an easy row to hoe. he had to defend the country on two fronts - from the attack of the Norse in the north-east(Stamford Bridge), and also from William the Conqueror in the south (Hastings). With the Norwegian forces, fighting against Harold at Stamford Bridge, was his own brother Tostig ... ouch! Individual Vikings held the bridge over the river against the English, allowing the Norse to grab the preferred higher ground before the battle was met. Lots of lives were lost, but eventually, Harold won. He then had to turn around what was left of his army and march from York to the southern coast, where he met William about two weeks later at Hastings ... there, with his army tired and depleated, with inferior arms, and a shield-wall strategy that failed, Harold lost.
* Who is the most impressive person from the old days?
I'll choose Pericles ...
Percles (495 BC-429 BC,) is perhaps the most well known statesman of the Greek city state of Athens. He can be read of in Thucydides' The History of the Peloponnesian War, he was the buddy of Socrates and was responcible for the building project which included the Parthenon. He was also a romantic, in love with a hetaera - a well educated and independant courtesan - named Aspasia, and though they couldn't marry, they lived together, their home an intellectual salon where writers and philosophers met. Pericles was a fosterer of democracy, as well as a great general. Below is a bit of his famous funeral speech from Thucydides ...
Our form of government does not enter into rivalry with the institutions of others. Our government does not copy our neighbors', but is an example to them. It is true that we are called a democracy, for the administration is in the hands of the many and not of the few. But while there exists equal justice to all and alike in their private disputes, the claim of excellence is also recognized; and when a citizen is in any way distinguished, he is preferred to the public service, not as a matter of privilege, but as the reward of merit. Neither is poverty an obstacle, but a man may benefit his country whatever the obscurity of his condition. There is no exclusiveness in our public life, and in our private business we are not suspicious of one another, nor angry with our neighbor if he does what he likes; we do not put on sour looks at him which, though harmless, are not pleasant. While we are thus unconstrained in our private business, a spirit of reverence pervades our public acts; we are prevented from doing wrong by respect for the authorities and for the laws, having a particular regard to those which are ordained for the protection of the injured as well as those unwritten laws which bring upon the transgressor of them the reprobation of the general sentiment ....
* Who is your favorite Roman Emperor?
I'd have to pick Marcus Aurelius. Nope, not because he was in Gladiator :-) but because of his Meditations. I first read the book in college, when I was trying very hard not to feel anything, and Stoicism really hit the mark. Here's an example ...
If thou art pained by any external thing, it is not this that disturbs thee, but thy own judgment about it. And it is in thy power to wipe out this judgment now.
I loved this idea that we can control our feelings. Not surprising that Aurelius would like it too ... by all accounts, he had a bad marraige, and his son ... !
- Richard Harris, from Gladiator, as Marcus Aurelius
* What's your favorite historical battle?
Another one of thos burning questions that keep us up at night! My choice would be the battle of Stamford Bridge and the battle of Hastings, together. They took place in England in 1066, and things went like this ...
The king of England, Harold Godwinson, did not have an easy row to hoe. he had to defend the country on two fronts - from the attack of the Norse in the north-east(Stamford Bridge), and also from William the Conqueror in the south (Hastings). With the Norwegian forces, fighting against Harold at Stamford Bridge, was his own brother Tostig ... ouch! Individual Vikings held the bridge over the river against the English, allowing the Norse to grab the preferred higher ground before the battle was met. Lots of lives were lost, but eventually, Harold won. He then had to turn around what was left of his army and march from York to the southern coast, where he met William about two weeks later at Hastings ... there, with his army tired and depleated, with inferior arms, and a shield-wall strategy that failed, Harold lost.
* Who is the most impressive person from the old days?
I'll choose Pericles ...
Percles (495 BC-429 BC,) is perhaps the most well known statesman of the Greek city state of Athens. He can be read of in Thucydides' The History of the Peloponnesian War, he was the buddy of Socrates and was responcible for the building project which included the Parthenon. He was also a romantic, in love with a hetaera - a well educated and independant courtesan - named Aspasia, and though they couldn't marry, they lived together, their home an intellectual salon where writers and philosophers met. Pericles was a fosterer of democracy, as well as a great general. Below is a bit of his famous funeral speech from Thucydides ...
Our form of government does not enter into rivalry with the institutions of others. Our government does not copy our neighbors', but is an example to them. It is true that we are called a democracy, for the administration is in the hands of the many and not of the few. But while there exists equal justice to all and alike in their private disputes, the claim of excellence is also recognized; and when a citizen is in any way distinguished, he is preferred to the public service, not as a matter of privilege, but as the reward of merit. Neither is poverty an obstacle, but a man may benefit his country whatever the obscurity of his condition. There is no exclusiveness in our public life, and in our private business we are not suspicious of one another, nor angry with our neighbor if he does what he likes; we do not put on sour looks at him which, though harmless, are not pleasant. While we are thus unconstrained in our private business, a spirit of reverence pervades our public acts; we are prevented from doing wrong by respect for the authorities and for the laws, having a particular regard to those which are ordained for the protection of the injured as well as those unwritten laws which bring upon the transgressor of them the reprobation of the general sentiment ....
posted by crystal | 10:05 PM
12 Comments:
Ah, Crystal, you put me to shame but I'll give it a try. My favorite Roman emperor was Caligula. I know, I know...but Camus' play made him a sympathetic figure.
My favorite historical battle was the Revolutionary War--for obvious reasons, and also because the first shot was fired on my birthday.
And the most impressive person from the old days? Definitely Ronald Reagan. :-)
Marcus is probably the best, as you say. My best friend, who's lived in Madrid for the last 17 years, swears by the Meditations. I've got to get around to reading them someday.
Battles:
It's hard not to admire that Spartan stand at Thermopylae, isn't it?
Lepanto was a pretty big deal.
Pork Chop Hill in Korea, because my father was there.
I guess I'm impressed by small groups of guys who hang in against impossible odds. At one time I remember being impressed by the Nationalist stand against the Republicans at the Alcazar in Toledo during the Spanish Civil War, even though their cause was all wrong...
Quote:
The single most famous incident connected with the siege of the Alcazar is the seizure by the Reds of Col. Moscardo's son. They put him on the phone to his father, and the young man confirmed that his captors intended to kill him if the Alcazar did not yield. "Then, my son," said the Colonel, "shout Viva el Cristo Rey and die like a Spaniard." The young man was executed.
...But when I actually visited the site on my first visit to Spain, and saw the congratulatory plaques inside the Alcazar from various fascist leaders, it sent a chill right through me...
Most impressive figure:
Of antiquity? I'm inclined to say Aristotle.
Hi Susan.
Caligula??? Wasn't there a very bad movie about him with Sting in it? :-). Well, you've got to love a guy who considered making his horse a senator.
All I know about the revolutionary war, I learned from watching the Patriot move with Mel ... it was a little jingoistic, but you got to see Mel fling a tomahock.
I don't know much about Reagon either. You put me to shame in the area of modern history :-)
Hi Jeff ,
I like Thermopylae too - those Spartans were impressive in their sacrifice. I also like movies where a few guys heroicly hold out against greater numbers, dying well :-). One example, I remember from the dim past, is Zulu, though I don't know about the real-life politics behind the story.
I don't know anything about Spanish history ... I'll have to read up on the civil war.
Aristotle is great! I learned about him in college, but all I remember is that he was Plato's student, Alexander the Great's teacher, Thomas Aquinas' hero, and he wrote that one swallow does not a summer make :-).
Jeff -- I heard that the story about the Alcazar was a fabrication, but perhaps that's wrong.
I don't know about my favorite emperor. In a way, the whole imperial system was so disfunctional, especially when it came to succession, it's amazing the empire was as successful as it was. The best emperor might well have been Trajan. The most impressive, for me, was Augustus. He was brutal in so many ways, but his political audacity and imagination were unmatched. He invented emperorship (Ronald Syme's book The Roman Revoltion shows how creative he really was politically).
I like the battles that never were: the Battle of Roncesvalles was nothing more that an attack on a Carolingian rear guard by Basque mauraders, but in the Song of Roland it began a great battle for Christiandom. For Spanish medieval history, you can't beat the Battle of Navas de Tolosa for importance.
Most impressive figure is very hard, since there were so many. In antiquity? Aristotle is not a bad choice, for philosophy and science. For miltary success, Alexander the Great. I could keep going...
Hi Liam,
I like Trajan too - all the five good emperors. The time of Octavian was interesting ... the stuff with Marc Anthony and Cleopatra ... he was pretty ruthless but really competant.
You agree with my friend Gabriele about the Song of Roland :-)
Alexander's a good choice. Was it Julius Caesar who wept at the sight of a statue of Alexander because, while the same age as Alexander at his death, he had accomplished so much less?
Zulu, with Michael Caine! Excellent flick. I like almost everything Michael Caine has ever done, even when he would take just about any film offer during his "Blame It on Rio" phase.
Liam,
You could very well be right. It has a note of fabrication about it, doesn't it? I doubt anyone will ever know for sure. I've heard that the son was executed about a month later. It all depends on who you ask. When I visited Spain in the mid-80's, a lot of those people from the Civil War era were still alive, the emotions were still raw, and nobody was quite yet sure that the experiment with democarcy in Spain was really going to fly.
Favourite Emperor?
I think I'll go for Hadrian. :)
He understood that the expansion of the empire had reached its limits and tried to fortify the status quo rather than pushing further. He wasn't afraid to live his bisexuality, and was very cultured.
Favourite battle?
Difficult one, there's so many interesting ones. I like those where an outnumbered army won thanks to the tactical skills of a general.
Most impressive person from old days?
Wallenstein.
Oh, and Liam, I linked to your blog. That PhD of yours sounds really interesting.
Hi Gabriele - I hoped you would drop by, since you're the history expert :-)
I like Hadrian too - the wll, the tomb, the villa, and Antinous - he's got it all.
Hmmm - I think you only picked Wally because he's in your novel - heh.
Lol, he is in my novel because I find him fascinating. :)
There's an excellent biography by Golo Mann but I don't know if it's got translated.
I'll see what I can find about him online ... he did live in interesting times :-)
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